Promoting women's leadership from communities to international forums: An interview with Marisol García Apagueño

How to inspire women to lead

We inspire the next generation of women leaders with the work we have been doing. In a short time, we have had a meeting with the Minister of Women, with congresswomen, with the Ministry of Culture and Tourism, and we are working on issues of protocols against violence against women and family members.

We met with the Decentralised Commission of Congress. What we are asking is that they, as a cabinet, put aside their political differences and stop judging politicians and really get to work for the good of the most vulnerable, which are the Indigenous peoples. They are more diplomatic, but on the other hand, we stamp our feet and tell them to really get to work, because here there are many things we need them to do and the only ones who make laws and decrees are them.

In December 2022, the The Presidency of the Superior Court of Justice of San Martín approved the "Intercultural Protocol of Attention and Coordination for Cases of Violence against Women and Members of the Family Group of the Kichwa Indigenous People of San Martín". The purpose of this protocol is to help people to access to public services for prevention, care and protection against violence against women and members of the family group of the Kichwa Indigenous People, in a culturally appropriate way and in the language they feel most comfortable in. We decided to work on this protocol so that the women themselves would be the ones to identify the type of violence they experience and propose solutions within their communities and with state organisations.

 

And, more than anything else, we are also trying to rescue and restore our cultural identity, our language, our clothing and our food.

 

For this, we are working on forming women's associations and telling them that organised women have a better chance of getting ahead. There are women in my community who are dedicated to reforestation, and women in other communities who are working to recover the skill of ceramics. We are trying to take one woman per community so that they can learn and then replicate new skills within their communities.  By working with one woman, we expect her to multiply, right?

The importance of making the work that we have been doing visible as a federation is also that it is encouraging more women to get involved in the issue of territorial problems, in the issue of rescuing our culture.

Why should we listen to the voices of indigenous women?

Going to COP26 was a great achievement for Indigenous women, not only in my region, but also in Peru. To do so, I have been the victim of many negative opinions from the presidents [of Indigenous organisations], saying that only men have always participated. This was the first time that two women have gone, and it was a bit painful for them. They said, “Poor things, they are going to be fooled by the NGOs and they are going to be victims, or they are just going to sit quietly and say nothing.’ From my point of view, we have shown the opposite.

 

We didn't go there to warm seats, we really went there to give our opinion, our point of view, and to not be very diplomatic if we don't want to be. We want the world to hear what is happening in the Peruvian Amazon and the things we are facing.

 

It is very important that Indigenous women participate in these spaces, like COP26. We live and face the problems day by day. It is very easy to send a congress member or a governor, as was the case in San Martin. The governor went to participate, but he doesn't really know the problems that exist in Indigenous territories.

The second reason why we should participate is because we are concerned. The high level of destruction in the Amazon is affecting the water sources, it is affecting the production of fruits, it is affecting the issue of why we no longer have many fish to feed birds or animals. We no longer have these because of the high level of logging which is totally destroying the Amazon.

 

The big cities are compulsive consumers. They demand something and they don't care how it reaches its destination. They think that if they have the money, they can buy a species that is in danger of extinction and not realise the impact it has on the environment of the Indigenous Peoples of the Amazon.

 

They only want to see the economic part, but they don't see the long-term impact and we, as the ones who pollute the least, are the ones who are paying the most for the consequences of climate change. So we want people to know from our own voice what we are facing and the actions we are taking to contribute to climate change mitigation. Not only because we want to ensure the existence of humanity, but also to defend our home.

That is where we live, that is our source of income, our source of food, our source of healing. So it is completely unconceivable for us to be told that we are going to be relocated. They are changing our habitat by carrying out all this destruction. And humanity needs to be aware of this so that they become aware of what they are doing, so that they also change their lifestyles.

 

We think that the rulers of the world, not only in Peru, are really trying to eradicate the original peoples. We are a nuisance for them, if they exterminate us they can expropriate everything - they are already doing it with the conservation areas they create without consulting us.

 

To really have to face these problems, humanity needs to know what the men and women of the Amazonian peoples are doing, simply because they want to defend their home and also because they want to guarantee the existence of humanity. That is  it. That is why it is very important for Amazonian women to be heard, isn't it? In big spaces that have an international impact.

Indigenous women at COP26

COP26 was a great experience.  Despite the fact that there were few women, the spaces for participation were very, very hard fought for us; we had to demand them and we wanted more space as women. They always give it to the men, but the chiefs didn't want to go and participate. And we had to say that we didn't go just to have a look around, we went to do advocacy, to raise awareness of the problems that the Amazon faces here in Peru.

Participating in the marches was something that has had an impact on us. As we returned, we could bring back that energy to our home, the energy to continue doing more, with more enthusiasm for our struggles and to say, "Come on, let's keep moving!"

 

Even it's true that in our country they don't pay attention to us, on the other side of the world there are people who have joined our cause, who are willing to support us, to listen to us and help us to make all these problems visible and maybe find a solution to them in the long run too, right?

 

And, well, the commitments of the great leaders - we are really seeing that in fact they don't have any. The oil spills continue and they continue to turn a deaf ear, a blind eye, and they are not facing this environmental pollution that is killing life on the planet. They are really acting as if they had just spilled a drop of something.

These oil spills reach the Amazon. There are entire communities that have to leave their community to live in other places because they no longer have water to drink, nor fish to catch. There is nothing to wash and cook with for the little ones.

According to what we have heard at the COP, all Indigenous peoples have the same problems, they face the same threats and they have all been dispossessed of their territories.

What was different in COP27 in Egypt?

COP27, on the other hand, was a huge challenge. Despite our efforts to bring and share the serious problems of our territory, we indigenous people only participated as observers. The intention of being part of this summit was to make visible our arduous work of defence, resistance and care of our Amazonia. However, we are not recognised and are excluded in the management and administration of protected areas by the Peruvian Ministry of Environment, The Peruvian Protected National Areas Service (SERNANP) and CIMA, the conservation NGO.

 

COP27 leaves us with a bitter taste full of frustration and impotence because we have to travel so far carrying the voices of men and women, the desolation of our elders and the uncertainty of our children for the future that awaits them.

 

There are so many things to consider, such as: Why hold it in Egypt where freedom of expression is condemned? Aren't the same companies that are killing us sponsoring this space? Why will COP28 be in Dubai?

However, we will continue to participate in more conferences until we are heard or until there is interest in listening to new proposals put forward by indigenous peoples.

Find out more about Marisol's experiences at COP27 here: Who listens to Indigenous Peoples? 

As a woman, for us it has been a battle to win and we know that many more women are also joining us because they also want to achieve something and speak up for others, for our brothers and sisters, for men and women, boys and girls, because that is what we went there to do. We went to be the voice of all our brothers and sisters here, of the communities, not only of the Kichwa ethnic group, but of the Amazon in general.

Kichwa Women Leaders' Workshops

It is very complicated to work with women's issues. Because we have lived with this concept of machismo, that women are useless, that women should not have an opinion, that women themselves have this same concept of saying 'I don't know, I can't, what will my husband say'. Therefore, it’s often women who put limitations on themselves.

We saw the intercultural workshops as necessary because we women already feel excluded and we have to look for space to be part of a federation or a board of directors. That's why we saw the need for our own space, first to realise what we need to do or improve so that we can be part of a board or committee.

As I was saying, many women think that their husbands are going to say no, that they can't go to the assembly, and if they do go, they can't have a say. So, in order to break these things down and improve self-esteem, to talk and strengthen leadership, we need this space for women to be honest with each other. A space to liberate ourselves, spiritually and personally, and to leave behind many things that sometimes stop us from moving forward.

There are many experiences that we have, stories that traumatise us and that psychologically we have not been able to overcome. Things that we have had to face at a young age; the issue of drug trafficking, terrorism, for example. Many women have been raped and these are things that they have been carrying around with them to this day and they feel that they continue to be victims of leaders who do not give them space or respect their opinions.

 

We have gained a lot from that space, because we have been able to get many people to recognise the things that prevent them from moving forward. They can tell themselves that if they allow themselves to, they can share their burdens, and then it’s easier to carry it shared than on your own.

 

If we all share that great tragedy that has happened to a woman at a young age, we will help her to carry it and she will no longer have so much. It is that heavy burden that sometimes means many of them even feel guilty for the misfortunes that have happened to them. This space has helped us realise how important all that is. They are not guilty and many of them realise that they have gone through similar experiences. Even so, they have done a lot of work to overcome these issues and today they are leading and strengthening this leadership to keep moving ahead.

 

Besides, we need to be healthy to be able to defend our territory, because sick women can’t defend. We understand that we have to be healthy first, not only physically, but also emotionally and spiritually.

 

Women’s leadership in Kichwa communities

Women's participation basically came out of our concern for what is happening in our territory, and also out of our own initiative to be part of decision-making processes with regard to our communities, or generally at the level of Indigenous Peoples. In my case, when I joined the Federation of Kichwa Indigenous Peoples of Chazuta Amazonas (FEPIKECHA) in 2017, I didn't see a single woman.

We are trying to promote and above all to recover the practical knowledge that women use every day. The subject of medicine and food, for example. Women hold more knowledge about our histories, legends and myths. Women are the ones who lie in bed with the children to read, to tell them the stories that our great-grandmothers and grandmothers used to tell us. In this, it’s the women who have an important role. We are trying to raise awareness of the importance of working together, because to have children you also need a man and a woman. It’s not just the men who do everything.

We are encouraging equity in all work, not only in being part of a committee, but also in everything that has to do with our community, at the organisational level, and in more important roles and tasks.

This interview has been edited for brevity and clarity.